Posts by Max Divergent

27

Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics

by bohm in

jw
friends

a basic problem with christian apologetics when applied to the bible is that it relies on the tacit assumption you can draw reliable conclusions on the material.

the most common form of apologetics start out by certain claims (the tomb was found empty, the disciples had post-crusifiction experiences of jesus that transformed their lives, etc.

this is hearsay since the person who made the statement cannot be sworn in.

Max Divergent

Why would anyone care to dissect the events surrounding Jesus' resurrection in order to know the truth about it?

I think you miss the point. The issue is whether the bible is of any value in determining what happened in the past and thus whether the bible is of any use in establishing beliefs for the present. And if it's not, then the foundation of the Western religions is just a historic curiosity of no more value than this stuff about some guy called Polonius. It's a pretty fundamental question in a Judeo-Christian context.

I can't understand why anyone would want to or even attempt to try to change a person's believe about Jesus' resurrection because I believe it is a very private matter between the person and the creator, if there really is one.

Other people's fervent belief in things for which there is no evidence has driven world politics and impacted individual's lives for good and ill for millennia. Challenging the weak foundations of others' beliefs is essential for human progress: otherwise we'd still be in the Dark Ages. Or fighting against the establishment of a Caliphate and terrorism (oh, that's right, we are...).

In my opinion (yeah, I have one of those too. I'm sitting on it) each person has the privilege of believing it or not and no one will be able to change their minds no matter what 'evidence' or suppositions they provide.

Rubbish. History proves this fatalistic passivity wrong, and hazardous.

Good post bohm.

23

Consequences of staying on the recommended Hotel list

by Samaritan At the Well in

i wanted to share an experience i had and see if anyone else had encountered this same matter.

we always tried to make an extra effort to ensure we stood on the approved hotel lists when going to our special day conventions or district conventions or what they now call regional.

we use to stay many nights a year and i would save up my hotel points to use at a later time.. i remember checking in at popular chain hotel and asked the hotel clerk how many points would i earn for the 3 night stay?

Max Divergent

I knew I was gone when making plans for a trip to a convention with another couple. There were so many other things I wanted to do at the location there wasn't time to go to the sessions!

The other couple were less un-devout than me and seemed to notice! I know they did coz they said 'what about going to the convention?'. To which there was no answer (I was an MS)!

LOL!

I stopped going to meetings soon after, so that must have answered their question.

And I sneered at the hotel list. That might have been noticed too.

53

Is Watchtower's stance against education only for North American witnesses

by wannaexit in

jw
friends

i was reading on a european ex jw forum where some feel that watchtower's railing against higher education is primarily for north america issue.

this is due that many in usa and canada leave home to leave on campus.

it was mentioned that many young european jw attend universities and its not frowned on.. i found this odd because i heard what morris and losch said about education in italy.

Max Divergent

The American-written rule about college doesn't translate quite perfectly into all non-American educational / vocational contexts, so loopholes may emerge out of the US.

And no Western culture is remotely as religious as America is, so the hold of any strict religion over its congregation must be weaker at a population level.

There may be a slightly weaker adherence to the rule out of the US as a result.

15

List your favorite, overused scripture by JW's!

by thedepressedsoul in

the title says it all.

list a scripture that is way over used.. it could be a scripture that the point is completely missed by how they use it.

it could also be one that they use so much it's as if the rest of the bible didn't exits.. my two favorite are proverbs 4:18 and ezekiel chapter 1 +a few verses.

Max Divergent

My favorite scripture underused by the WT but sometimes overused by JWs is Proverbs 31:6-7

Give alcohol to those who are perishing
And wine to those in bitter distress.
Let them drink and forget their poverty
Let them remember their trouble no more.

34

Congregation that have sent in money!

by DwainBowman in

in the past week, i have heard from a number of friends scattered all over the place.

a number of them are very upset over the congregation being required, to send in all monies over $4,000.

a number of these were kh's that were saving to buy land, and or build new kh's.

Max Divergent

It's a bit rude: one organisation (the local KH) collecting money for a specific project the donor is interested in, but then passing the funds to another organisation to do other projects anywhere.

It'd be kind of like signing up for one of those programs to sponsor a child in the third world and getting all exited you're going to see the results of that sponsorship, just to be told your money has been taken from that child and put into a fund to be used to help someone somewhere one day.

Probably legal, depending on the circumstances and local laws, but alienating for donors with self-respect.

23

i know this has been talked about. but isn't wearing JW.org stuff idol worship

by goingthruthemotions in

jw
friends

so i am getting really frustrated...i see jdub's wearing jw.org items and .

isn't this idol worship.

respond if you like...i just want some .

Max Divergent

There's not much about the JWs that's the same as when my grandparents took it up in the 1930s or when my parents were indoctrinated into it. Even in my time it's changed a lot. I think my mother still practices a quasi-1960s version of it. They just redefine stuff to suit the needs of the day.

I'm sure they used to wear pins and badges in the early days? Or am I imagining that?

It's just advertising, advertising, advertising God's online Kingdom.

51

Is this a discussion forum or a debating forum , which is it ?

by smiddy in

jw
friends

do you get confused sometimes whether this site is a discussion forum or a debating forum ?.

just asking.

whats your thoughts.. smiddy.

Max Divergent

It's a discussion forum that often descends into mass debating.

67

Good Netflix shows to watch

by Simon in

in the long winter nights you need some good tv shows to watch while you wait for the eternity between seasons of game of thrones.. we've watched marco polo (pretty good) and have just started watching orange is the new black which is not at all what i imagined (didn't know it was funny!).

house of cards is on the list too as we've heard good things about that.. anyone have any others that are worth seeing?.

Max Divergent

Just started watching Portlandia - fabulous satire.

Rake is fabulous too, the Australian original not the US version. It's about an off-the-rails barrister.

15

List your favorite, overused scripture by JW's!

by thedepressedsoul in

the title says it all.

list a scripture that is way over used.. it could be a scripture that the point is completely missed by how they use it.

it could also be one that they use so much it's as if the rest of the bible didn't exits.. my two favorite are proverbs 4:18 and ezekiel chapter 1 +a few verses.

Max Divergent

They overuse the bible, actually. What they teach is only similar to some of the bible for their convenience.

53

Is Watchtower's stance against education only for North American witnesses

by wannaexit in

jw
friends

i was reading on a european ex jw forum where some feel that watchtower's railing against higher education is primarily for north america issue.

this is due that many in usa and canada leave home to leave on campus.

it was mentioned that many young european jw attend universities and its not frowned on.. i found this odd because i heard what morris and losch said about education in italy.

Max Divergent

I knew a small handful in Australia who took higher education about the time I did: I studied 1997-2000 and left the JWs in 1998. I can think of about five in two congs who were studying, or had recently finished studying, when I left.

The excuse was always that they needed to get a qualification to meet their scriptural responsibility to support their family (all male). I said the same.

I don't remember anyone being given a hard time or losing privileges as a result. I don't think any of them were very active or 'in to' being a JW, even if they were current or former E/MS/Pio, but so far as I know the others stayed in. Mostly second or third gen. I think studying was more a point of novelty than being very problematic in the cong.

I remember publishers (not so much E/MS) quizzing me about whether the lecturers were as good public speakers as the brothers. I think it was curiosity more than anything. The few who did have an education (usually from before getting into the JWs) always seemed to be regarded as a bit special, and being the 'good elders' or whatever.